Purposed Raid changes

[Brisea]

The following is a list of the purposed raid changes:

Level 60 1st ages be worth 1.00, Level 59 1st ages worth 0.75

The value of 1st ages has come down since we are now doing the turtle 3 or 4 times a night. Once the watcher is down there well be ever more passed out per week and many ppl are now passing on them. If this change takes effect we will update the rapid raid for all those who have obtained one.

To gain attendance points you have to be logged into vent and into the correct channel

A couple of things to this rule. The reason for this rule is because with all the peoples alts and the bugs in the kin list feature of the game it is very hard to take a accurate attendance for inside the game. Some ppl may not be able to log into vent for one reason or another but if you can't be on vent you should contact SeAnn or the Raid leader of the run (usually Skyrend, Coal, or Myself) and let us know you are there and ready but not on vent. If you are on standby you can leave the channel but you need to stay on vent thru the duration of the raid in case you are needed.

Non Kin members will only be allowed into runs if there are no Kin members available

This is something that shouldn't have to be said but I fell should be included just in case

Kin members who have characters outside the Kin can only spend their points on characters that are in the Kin unless the points where earned with the non-kin member.

We have not and will not discourage ppl from having alts in other kinships. However, I fell it’s unfair to the entire kin for someone to use there characters in this kinship to gear up a character that’s in another kin to raid with them. If we bring some ones character from outside the kin to do runs then points will be put into that character separate from their character(s) in the kin. After earning enough points on their character outside the kin they can then spend their points on them.

If you qualify for standby points but refuse to go on a run for any reason you forfeit those points

Shouldn't need a explanation.

Mains have priority over alts

Ok, this is a big one........When we first started raiding there where a few (very voiceful) ppl who were opposed to this rule so it wasn't included. However, in the 2 meetings I’ve had there have been several ppl that brought it up and seem to think (like I do) that it should be included. I will try to be objected to this as much as I can and hopefully we will get a lot of feedback for or against it.

The reason people are against it. Put simple they are your points, you earned them, and you should be able to spend them on any character you chose.

The reason people are for it. Once you chose a class as your main that ONE character gets priority. (you only compete against other ppl that also chose that class, not the whole kinship) After the people with a certain class (chosen as mains) have received items/gear/weapons then they will become available to everyone else who has the class but didn't chose it as there mains. Our purpose for having a points system and rules is so that we as a kin progress. For all the people who have multiple characters getting them all geared up gives our kin more flexibility but getting as many people geared up 1st I fell should take priority.

Awarding more points to the people in the raid then the people on standby

If this rule goes into effect it would not be for the turtle. It has been proposed for the watcher (until it is on farm status) and DN.

The reason this comes up is because these raids are learning raids where the people in them are going thru the frustration of wiping ALOT and high repair cost.

My opinion on this varies somewhat. Our selection process for classes for a "learning" raid is defined in the raid rules. "Class Balance > Gear/traits > Priority cycle". The reason for this is not to exclude people from getting into raids but to put together a good group and try to keep that group together as much as possible to "learn" the raid. When we randomly select people for raids we can't (or haven’t) completed we spend way to much time getting people up to speed that we end up taking a step back instead of progressing which adds further to the frustrations. Adding some kind of benefit to the people who are selected would help encourage their future participation.

On the downside with a kin our size there will always be people who want in the raid and would be willing to accept the cost so I think penalizing them would be wrong too. Also, take into account that some classes have less competition getting into runs then others. Therefore, Classes with less competition would get into runs more often and get more points on the average.

Personally I don't like the idea of giving more points to the ppl in the run then the ones on standby but I would like to add something to for the hard work that’s done by the people who turn a "learning" raid into a raid that EVERYONE benefits from like the turtle. Hopefully some people can give some Idea's on it that everyone can agree too. The only suggestion I have is to award A "BIG" bonus to the 1st group that drops a new boss the 1st time. OR, apply an extra 0.50 to everyone in the groups (not standby) just until a new boss is downed the 1st time.


I may have forgot something that was talked about so if anyone wishes to include something thats not in here.... Go for it. Please add your feed back for or against anything thats here. We only want to do what the kin as a whole wants to make the game more enjoyable to everyone.

[Skyrend]

For the most part I completly agree with the proposed changes.But i feel we will need to get the watcher on farm mode fast to avoid hurting the feelings of kin members that are always "good to go" friday nite for the watcher,but always get left out of the run.thusly gaining less loot points long term.I think its fair that those members running the watcher going thru all those whipes and spending gold to retrait be givin either .25 or .5o more points for that nites run.I would lean towards .25 to avoid creating any major point deficits between those members running the watcher and those with poor traits and gear who do not get to come on the run.

[Gronkette]

The only rule I have a bit of difficulty with is the difference in points between those that are on standby and those in the raid. To tell you the truth, I am kind of torn ... I feel those that do the run deserve an extra reward for the pain inflicted on them from all the deaths, but then I also think of those that really want to do the run and don't give two hoots about having a large repair bill.

For efficiency's sake I recognize the requirement to try to have the same ppl do the run at least until it succeeds. In this case though, we are only staving off the pain that will be felt when the monster goes to farm mode since each person that has not been "trained" will mean errors, deaths and more repairs for all. If you only allow one or maybe two noobs in at a time you will be applying a "choke" on how fast players in the kin acquire watcher items anyway.

Also, I feel Sky is right about other ppl who are always ready but never chosen becoming disappointed about the whole raid thing. It is very disheartening to be prepared to accept the consequences (even up to the point of offering to compensate other raid members for their repair bills if the "noob" messes up) but never get asked along because there is a plethora of that particular char class available, or favouritism is suspected of being a factor.

This rule needs a fair amount of additional thought before it is enacted. As a suggestion, might it be possible to do some kin runs on money making quests like CD to raise additional cash in kinbank to offset ppl's repair costs for learning runs so that we can keep the earned points the same for all? Give it a thought. I would be perfectly willing to do runs for high value items on AH to build a float to cover costs like this. In the end, it can only benefit all of us.